Hi Bernardo
I don't thing the soul of anybody / anything wants to go "along to
reconciliation and happiness". Probably this is our ego having such wish and
longing all the time for some paradise. The soul knows only walking along
the spiral, from simple structure to more complex one, from narrow sight to
open horizon(s). From this spiral the repetitions come so well known by all
of us. As the facilitators we do not heal, (because we do not know, what is
for our client "good" and what "ill" or "evil" - we do not know this even
for ourselves) we only help to open the door on the spiral, sometime the one
the soul wants to enter, sometime the wrong one. These doors are often
blocked by things that are not seen, not accepted, not competed, not put "in
the right place" by the client or his system. The size of these obstructions
is bigger, if the events they created them are young and/or heavy. The older
are the events, the finer the obstruction, more "homeopathically" refined
and reaching more in our "group or tribal soul". In the same time, they lost
their urgency.
So if you are working on an "old level" (many generation back), you
encounter other kind of entanglements, other energies. You will meet
different kind of soul (it has many faces...). And there is of course not an
"origin", only more and more mist of the time.
So this is my way to see it, sorry for my horrible English.
Jan.
_____
From: ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Bernardo Ramirez
Sent: Friday, June 20, 2008 12:22 PM
To: ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [ConstellationTalk] about receiving and loyalty - and
repetitions...
Hi all,
Actually the point of "If you keep looking again and again for the origin of
each situation or feeling until you notice a complete relief or relaxation
in the body of the client then you will find it much more easy to follow the
systemic signs that the soul has placed along the road to reconciliation and
happiness." makes me raise a question that I hope you will be able to
comment on.
With my brief experience with constellations I have seen in the family
system many issues about repetition. I have noticed that you can always go
back and find reasons for the present events. But like a spiral, if you
continue to go back, you will find yet another repetition and another.
In your experience does it end? Can you find an origin? Or is this just in
layers? Like Shrek's Onions?
Thanks in advance...
Bernardo
On Fri, Jun 20, 2008 at 8:27 AM, Margreet Mossel <margreetmossel@
<mailto:margreetmossel%40wish.net> wish.net>
wrote:
Hi Anitareceive,
I just looked at your mail and I would like add something to your story.
Systemic work looks at the whole system and not to the personal emotional
or
behavioural situations! Before blaming someone that he or she cant
better look at the history first, that saves years of therapies!ngen.com/>
In the story that you describe maybe you could first look at the situation
around the original heritage, and look for clues in the family about who
was
guilty or should have been guilty. If this woman is just loyal to someone
in
or outside the family who lost everything or their house due to another
persons gain - in or outside the family, then of course her children will
never be able to help her!
Working with the different levels of consciences is what makes systemic
work
completely different from eg psychotherapy. If you keep looking again and
again for the origin of each situation or feeling until you notice a
complete relief or relaxation in the body of the client then you will find
it much more easy to follow the systemic signs that the soul has placed
along the road to reconciliation and happiness. The body is always right
and
always knows the way: I trust this observation until something else shows
me
it is different.
Good luck and all the best
Margreet Mossel
The Netherlands
www.opstellingen.com <http://www.opstelli ;<http://www.opstellingen.com/>
yahoogroups.com<ConstellationTalk%40yahoogroups.com>
_____
Van: ConstellationTalk@ <mailto:ConstellationTalk%40yahoogroups.com>
[mailto:ConstellationTalk@ ;<mailto:ConstellationTalk%40yahoogroups.com>yahoogroups.com<ConstellationTalk%40yahoogroups.com>]
Namens Anita Royyahoogroups.com<ConstellationTalk%40yahoogroups.com>
Verzonden: zondag 15 juni 2008 20:54
Aan: ConstellationTalk@ <mailto:ConstellationTalk%40yahoogroups.com>
Onderwerp: Re: [ConstellationTalk] apology for Residential Schools in
Canada
The theme of not being able to receive and take is very interesting to me.
I
am working with a family whose mother finds it extremely difficult to
receive. However, I am not doing FC with them, as I am not yet trained
enough for FC, but certainly the principles of FC do keep reappearing,
especially re family order. This woman was ready to lose her house to the
banks, which was paid for initially by an inheritance and then borrowed
against, rather than have four out of her eight grown up children, living
at
home, with good jobs, contribute to room and board at home, though they
were
willing. They were squandering their paychecks until recently.
What I have found is that not being able to receive is a need to maintain
power and control. When we refuse to take what is offered, we maintain
control and have a monopoly on the giving. Aside from the obvious
martyrdom,
there are the usual questions of rage, self worth and inability to feel
loved.
Anita
2008/6/14 Angelika Chisholm <wings4angelika@
<mailto:wings4angelika%40clear.net.nz ;<wings4angelika%2540clear.net.nz>>
clear.net.nz>:
At a recent conversation with a well informed Maori women, we talked
about
the theme of giving and receiving , *where she had the following to say
..........
she put the extensive loss down to the absence/inability to accept the
compensation, with rage being the blockage.*
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