Hello Chris and others,
I have read your comments re CIS (debriefing) and would like to make the
point that not all the research points to damaging effects. There is
considerable controversy in the literature about this topic. Those who
support the idea call the process Critical Incident Stress Management (see
anything by Robyn Robinson), which may or may not include a debrief. I guess
I would just caution against using terminology such as "proven" when
discussing research. Correlational statistics in general do not prove
anything, they only point to correlations. Most research is based on
correlational statistical analyses. I do think to say that people who
receive some form of CISM are damaged by it is taking things too far. An
initial phase of CISM is to assess what physical and social supports people
have and to do a basic assessment. The purpose of the assessment is simply
to note who may be at risk in the following days or weeks and to ensure that
colleagues or family and the person involved are aware of how to access
assistance should it be required. A form of CISM- peer support programs such
as conducted by the Queensland Ambulance Service, continue to be researched
and I refer you to a recent piece of research which is an example of the
specificity of some of the research Lowery K, & Stokes M , (2005) Role of
Peer Support and Emotional Expression on Post Traumatic Stress Disorder in
Studnet Paramedics, Journal of Traumatic Stress, Vol, 18,(2) pp 171-179
Still enjoying the site.
Best Regards
Anne Marie Field
-----Original Message-----
From: ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Chris Walsh
Sent: Sunday, 4 September 2005 9:52 AM
To: ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: [ConstellationTalk] Constellations for New Orleans?
Dear Thomas
Soul work is generally slow . The people in New Orleans
need practical help right now - food, medicine, shelter & security.
You and Bert Hellinger are right. They do NOT need critical incident stress
debriefing. All the research shows that it worsens the incidence and
severity of post traumatic stress disorder and other psychological sequelae.
It says a lot about therapists' motivations and grandiosity that many
insist on continuing a proven harmful intervention.
Much also needs to be sorted out on the political level. Cuba recently did a
much better job looking after their hurricane victims. You might want to
check out this article <http://www.truthout.org/docs_2005/090305Y.shtml>
http://www.truthout.org/docs_2005/090305Y.shtml which was sent to me by
Stephan Bajon. It explains a lot more about this.
I think it is very useful for constellators to be aware of key points of
history like this. It often provides useful contextual information when
facilitating a constellation. It also helps us to see where constellation
work might fit in relation to other interventions. This includes practical
interventions at a survival level as well as psychological and spiritual
interventions.
Hasta la vista
Chris Walsh
Melbourne, Australia
Website www.constellationflow.com
-----Original Message-----
From: ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of tmasthenes13
Sent: Saturday, September 03, 2005 8:55 AM
To: ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [ConstellationTalk] Constellations for New Orleans?
John, Dan, and Diane:
Thank you for your warm and heart-felt responses to my questions
about Bert. I will respond to each of your insights in more detail
later, but for now the situation in New Orleans seems to demand an
even greater response from Hellinger-folk.
We do family constellations, structural constellations with abstract
elements represented and thus personified, and there is the whole
field of organizationl constellations.
Has anyone thought of doing a constellation for the catastrophe in
New Orleans? If so, how would one go about it? Or would such an
undertaking be a heretical breach of the Orders of Love?
Again from my limited reading of Uncle Bert, I would imagine that his
response would be to let them be --- that for the sake of their human
dignity and greatness, they are strong enough to carry the fate that
has befallen them, and that we outsiders would simply be interfering
with their fate/karma/destiny by doing anything to help them, even
doing a constellation for them.
I glean this from the interview that Bertold Ulsamer posted back on
June 2, 2003, where Bert speaks about the ski-resort cable-train
accident in Kaprun, Austria that killed 170 people back in November
2000. (Search for Post #82 in the Message Index).
Now EggBert rightfully and righteously socks it to those shrinks,
counselors and priests sent in to minister to the relatives of the
suddenly deceased, who have selfish or Narcissistic motivations:
"But some of the outsiders who go to the victims to comfort them do
it for themselves; they're relieving themselves instead of helping
others."
(What a great image, as I pun across the translation to picture these
self-absorbed helpers pissing on the victims. (For modesty sake, I
only picture the male micturators.)
However, what about the therapeutic outsiders who are motivated by
the suffering of the victims? Are they then to do nothing because
they would interfere with the dignity and "greatness" of the grieving
relatives?
What the hell is greatness anyway (besides an iffy translation from
the German word Größe, which also refers to shoe size)? I mean here
we sit & shrivel in a post-apocalyptic, post-post-modern epoch of
hyper-self-consciousness, yes, in the throes of Narcissistic
Personality Disorder, but still, some of these quaint ideas of Bert --
as well as Bert himself --- (God love the Wunder-Kraut and all that;
I'm not Knock-wursting him by any means)---are just soooo 20th
century!!!
Where is the confidence in our 3rd millennium AMERICAN experience in
which cynicism grows so great that it turns on itself and self-
destructs like the trusty auto-phagic Ouroboros? (not to mention the
cassette tape on "Mission Impossible" exploding in Peter Graves'
phone booth after 15 seconds.)
Look, all I'm saying is Bert is right; but we Americans in 2005 are
even righter! (There are Anglo-germanic linguistic reasons why this
is so; more on that another time.)
Lest I keep digressing, let us get back to my original question: what
can we constellators do, if anything, about the situation in New
Orleans?
At least one of our forum members here, Stefan Bajon, a stalwart
member of the repre- and facile-to-be community here in Los Angeles,
is a native of the Big Easy, and still has family members there now.
May we grasp for the cosmic and invoke the Greater Soul in a
constellation for New Orleans, or do we just piddle around with the
lesser soul trappings we're used to appropriating for our own
families and organizations, however wonderful they are?
Maybe the "greatness" Bert talks about is to be found not in leaving
these people to their fate, but in ratcheting up our own more global
Greater Soul consciousness so we can find our Greater Soul connection
with these people in New Orleans. (After all, "atonement" can be
punnily hyphenated to read: "at-one-ment.")
So, what's "sauce for the gander is sauce for the goose." Therefore,
if Bert and his Constellators are going to invoke the biologically
restricted morphogenetic field concept of Rupert Sheldrake, then why
not invoke the unlimited and far GREATER SOURCE of Sheldrake's idea,
which, among many, for example, is the quantum potential field of
consciousness of David Bohm, famous for his idea of "implicate order"
in the universe, where consciousness is primary, beyond space and
time, where information travels with infinite speed and instead of a
vacuum void of nothingness, there is the teeming infinite fullness or
pleroma in which all consciousness may be tapped by each and every
ordinary human being.
You see, to me, Sheldrake's concept is passable for characterizing
the way the soul works, but it is restricted to the animal kingdom,
and therefore minimalist and downright clunky for describing the
subtle energies playing out in HUMAN constellations. Though we share
many characeristics, I am much more than my bird or monkey bretheren.
If you look at evolution PHENOMENOLOGICALLY, then animals evolved
from us humans and not the other way around, so that I as primal
HUMAN BEING am the friggin' ancestor of the birds and monkeys, not
the other way around. Kapish?
Why all this is important for New Orleans, is that I believe we are
in doing constellations, actually artifically restricting ourselves
to the biological Under-Soul of the animal kingdom instead of
reaching up for the GREATNESS of the Over-Soul of the human kingdom
whose point of departure is the PARTICULAR/INDIVIDUAL human SPIRIT as
it crosses the dimension of the UNIVERSAL/GENERAL human SOUL.
Many individuals trapped in the fate of New Orleans are descending
into a generalized animalistic state, a least common denominator of
generic soul soup turning into a psychic cesspool. I need y'all to
imagine constellation work (even healing reaching-out rituals?)that
may throw them a spirit/soul life preserver to them.
We're onto something like really conscious focussed prayer
here. "Wherever two or more are gathered..."
May I borrow from David Bohm and invoke the term, the "Implicate
Order of Love?"
So what may we do about New Orleans from a constellating point of
view? I'd love to hear from the lurkers on the list, as well as the
regulars.
Thomas (Aquinas, anyone?)
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