Hi folks
With Chris' permission I am writing to let you know that we are in the process
of a major re-organisation with the subscription process for The Knowing Field.
A new website is being designed and it is hoped that at least the bones of it
will be ready by June when the next issue comes out. With my grateful thanks to
Don Opatrny for his support with the setting up and running of the previous
one, I would ask that for the interim period you email my administrator Maz
Brown, in connection with all subscriptions. Mazb333@xxxxxxxxx.
Discussions are also underway with regard to possibilities for future
co-operation with ISCA.
Watch this space!
Good wishes to all
Barbara Morgan
Sent from my iPhone
On 31 Mar 2015, at 21:54, "familyconstellationinfo
familyconstellationinfo@xxxxxxxxx [ConstellationTalk]"
<ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Dear Meike
Thankyou for sharing re this topic of responsibility and suicide. Suicide is
the egos last stand, in fact it is because the ego feels responsible that it
chooses to die. Feeling responsible is feeling in charge of ones life....the
ego says "at least I can choose"...."I am in control". Suicide is the
ultimate stand of the victim/perpetrator ego structure when it reaches the
boundary of moving beyond conscience. This always involves death in a "kill
or be killed action." It is the final identification with the "I".
It is the "I" that always feels responsible because it is identified with
itself. Associated with the I and the ego there is always choosing via
identification. This means that there is no space or gap of no mind or
attunement to the wider field where choicelessness is able to be
guided.....in silent movement into the unknown. There is no awareness....no
meditation. This is always a danger in this work.
"I choose" and "I am responsible" can be a dangerous habit ......as any
suicide can show.
Kind regards
Sadhana Kay Needham
Sent on the go with Vodafone
-------- Original message --------
From: "Maria Goossens goossens.maria@xxxxxxxxxx [ConstellationTalk]"
Date:01/04/2015 2:09 AM (GMT+10:00)
To: ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [ConstellationTalk] ethics and constellations
Hi Zaquie,
What I’m saying is this: as a physician, I’m responsible for my patient if I
choose to use constellations as a therapeutic tool.
We have tremendous possibilities using constellations.
1) I can choose to do a constellation for my patient, yes or no. If his
mental state is unstable, I will choose not do a constellation.
2) I can choose the issue with which I work. f.e. I can first do
constellations that support my patient.
3) I can choose the representatives that I put up.
4) I can choose if I let my patient say certain sentences yes or no.
5) I can choose whether I express certain feelings that come up during the
constellation, or I can stay silent.
6) I even can choose to stop a constellation.
So, yes there is a greater force working during constellations that we cannot
command nor predict. However, we also have the possibility to make a lot of
choices before, at the start, during and at the end of constellations.
Mieke
Maria Goossens, MD
goossens.maria@xxxxxxxxxx
Op 31 mrt. 2015, om 16:59 heeft Zaquie Meredith zaquie@xxxxxxxxxx
[ConstellationTalk] <ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> het volgende
geschreven:
Maria Groossens, here is what I think, feel and learned:
Constellation is not equivalent to any method or technique where the
physician is responsible for his patient.
FurthermoreŠin constellations there are greater forces that we can not
command or predict.
Therefore, even you, could not have helped if you were present at the
constellation. I doubt you could.
If the constellation had not been done, would he have committed suicide?
Probably. But we don¹t know.
Bert Hellinger had 1 or 2 or patients that committed suicide after his
constellations. And some constellators went thru this experience too.
It is NOT the constellation that drives a person to commit suicide. This
is already in the field.
Perhaps what was in the field the constellator did not perceive. However,
even if it was perceived, what could have been done?
We need to be more humble towards this greater force.
And accept the clients choice. Nothing else we can do.
Zaquie C Meredith
Sao Paulo, Brazil
Socióloga, Consteladora e Psicoterapeuta
http://www.zaquie.com/
Author of Book: The Conscience of our Sensations (amazon)
Linkedin: http://br.linkedin.com/in/zaquie
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/zaquie.meredith
Twitter: http://twitter.com/zaquiemeredith
On 31/03/15 11:31, "Maria Goossens goossens.maria@xxxxxxxxxx
[ConstellationTalk]" <ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Dear all,
As a result of the suicide of one of my patients short after a
constellation done by a colleague, I want to rise an ethical issue.
As a physician, at least in Belgium, we are ALWAYS responsible for our
patients. I raised this issue before the start of the workshop I
organized for my colleague. This responsibility makes, that even if the
colleague does the constellation, I¹m still the physician of my patients.
My colleague did not agree that I participated as the physician of my
patients. His idea was that I was as one of the other participants. Seen
I could not take my responsibility towards my patients, I stayed home the
second day in order not to disturb the ongoing workshop.
With the feedback of my patients, with the suicide in mind, the issue
that I want to rise is the following:
As a physician we have full responsibility for the well-being of our
patients, promote their health and relieve their pain.
The position is different for a psychologist or another care-giver.
As a physician, whatever treatment we use, including constellations, we
always have full responsibility for the treatment we choose and our
patients.
Second point is that patients always have to ask for help at the
physician in the first place. So, as a physician we are not allowed to
send them emails with invitations for workshops.
It¹s clear for myself that I was not acting in line with the ethics of my
profession that particular weekend. I placed the wishes of my colleagues
above the ethics of my profession.
Whether my presence at the workshop could have prevented this suicide, we
will never know.
For myself, it feels as very important that the ethics of my profession
could be recognized by colleagues doing constellations.
Mieke
Maria Goossens, MD
goossens.maria@xxxxxxxxxx
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