Message
Subject: Re: [ConstellationTalk] Extended Family
Chris, very well put. Let us all not forget that "illness" can be the
resolution? As death should be respected so should illness. It doesn't mean we
should "help" if invited to but know somewhere on a deeper level it serves some
unseen purpose. Include that purpose with love as if we reject a condition seen
as "bad" then we aren't in harmony with the whole which includes fate and
destiny as well plus allot of mystery thrown into the mix.
I've personally felt depressed in roles too, one big one was representing a
Lithuanian Great grandfather whose brood left for the new world for a better
life. When I was seen included and respected I felt incredible peace and my
great grand daughter knew that she was a Lithuanian at her core. Very moving
and I knew that night that this work was for me.
Sincerest love GARY STUART LA, CA
----- Original Message -----
From: Chris Walsh
To: ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Saturday, November 26, 2005 2:06 AM
Subject: RE: [ConstellationTalk] Extended Family
Thanks for your thought provoking contribution Francesca.
I don't think a family soul/system is clearly circumscribed. Ultimately we
all affect each other somehow. Defining who belongs to the system is simply a
cognitive device that tells us where to look for strong interactions. You found
those strong interactions among cousins and between a woman and her nieces and
nephews. That serves to remind us that the orders evolved from observing the
phenomena in the first place. So phenomena takes precedence over orders.
Objective facts from the real world then take precedence over phenomena
observed in constellations. Being mindful of these meta-orders, helps to keep
us grounded.
I find it fascinating that you have nominated two of the most common physical
conditions that can mimic depression - diabetes and thyroid disease. Another
common mimic is anaemia. Doctors are taught to check for these sorts of
conditions in anyone presenting with depression.
You are also right when you say constellations are not always the best
solution. After all, even if someone had all their systemic entanglements
resolved, they still have to die of something, either accident or illness.
There best way to manage an illness depends on the illness, the person
suffering the illness and what treatments are available. So it is worthwhile
remembering Abraham Maslow's aphorism: "When the only tool you have is a
hammer, every problem begins to resemble a nail."
Hasta la vista
Chris Walsh
Melbourne, Australia
Website www.constellationflow.com
-----Original Message-----
From: ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of francescamasonboring
Sent: Saturday, November 26, 2005 7:25 AM
To: ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [ConstellationTalk] Extended Family
Winter Blessings and thank you's for all of the insights.
Sometimes I wonder if Hellinger's original work was based primarily
on a monocultural urban population, predominantly with nuclear family
structures. As he stepped into more cultures with extended family
structures, and other possibilities such as poligamy and purchased
brides, he seemed to become increasingly phenomenological.
Working in Native American communities, a large variety of ethnic
immigrants, rural populations, and many extended families it often
seems safest to work phenomenologically.
I shared with Stephan directly, but in light of the continuation of
the conversation it seems appropriate to share one constellation with
the chat:
A depressed woman, who's sister was dying, was "leaving". She had
children and her dying sister had children. She was following her
dying sister and completely unaware of her own children.
The children of the depressed woman were unable to draw the attention
of the depressed woman, and they were distressed (originally the
constellation included the depressed woman, her own children, and the
dying sister). The children of the depressed woman were aware that
someone was missing. I followed their direction and placed as many
individuals as they needed present. The number of the additional
persons placed turned out to be the number of children the dying
woman had. (Of course, no one in the constellation knew the dying
woman or how many children she had.)
Once the nieces and nephews of the depressed woman were placed, the
depressed woman began to recover her energy. The depressed woman and
the nieces and nephews were drawn together, and she began to comfort
them. The nieces and nephews drew the depressed woman's attention to
her own children, and she was then able to see them as well.
The nieces and nephews were, and still are, what inspired the
depressed woman to continue to stand in life through the death and
loss of her sister.
In Shoshone language we do not talk about "cousins". My male cousins
are either my "big-brothers" or my "younger-brothers", depending upon
our relationship in age. In the language, the group conscience, the
definition of "cousin" has a different context than in dominant
society. It seems that cousins, or nieces and nephews are not
unusual in my circles..not sure if it's my own schema, or the groups
who make up the circles. Certainly, not as common as the nuclear
family and ancestors, but not unusual.
A quick note on depression and antidepressants. In the U.S. the
politics of pharmeceutical drugs is so pronounced that the discussion
is probably unique in some ways. However, I appreciate the suggestion
that anyone working with constellation should have some idea about
clinical depression. It's also good to be aware that the body in
general may be in distress. I have suggested a good physical,in a
couple instances and it turned out to be a better intervention.
Thyroid disorder & diabetes, (I'm sure folks more knowledgable than I
could expand this)can sometimes be misunderstood as a psych
disorder. (of course, we know that stress, etc can impact the
body...chicken/egg...but it's easier for someone to integrate when
they are physically well, if that's possible).
People are wise. They feel like something is wrong because something
is wrong. Not always is constellation the best immediate solution.
Again, gratitude for such a wealth of teachers.
All My Relations,
Francesca
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