Fangyi,
You have described a valid flow problem with one of the 81 cases that can
occur in IIS 6.1 models. And I agree that by adding additional IR outputs
to Rx and Tx AMI_Init (then there are 625 cases) these kinds of problem
goes can go away for if the model maker writes AMI_Init with the
additional IR output.
The point I have been trying to make is that when we implement in the
standard the optional ability to add these additional IR outputs to AMI
Init, in IBIS 7.x, then the flows will still need to support all 625
cases, including the 81 cases in IBIS 6.1.
* Will not the 7.x flows need to describe the flows for these 81
case?
* Will not the flows for these 81 cases need to be the exact flows I
describe in BIRD 166.3?
I claim the answer to both of these questions must be yes. And if this is
the case then nothing I have written in BIRD 166.3 for IBIS 7.0 becomes
invalid for these 81 cases.
I repeat the question that you have not answered.
What bad things happen if BIRD 166.3 is included in IBIS 7.0?
Walter
Walter Katz
<mailto:wkatz@xxxxxxxxxx> wkatz@xxxxxxxxxx
Phone 303.449-2308
Mobile 303.335-6156
From: ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of
fangyi_rao@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Monday, May 8, 2017 4:17 AM
To: wkatz@xxxxxxxxxx; ibis-macro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [ibis-macro] Re: Fangyi and I had an AR to describe what bad
things can happen if IBIS 166.2 is approved in 7.0 and the Keysight BIRD
with additional IR is approved in IBIS 7.1 ...
(Resend with typo fixed)
All,
In the attached doc I showed that the BIRD166 flow may unphysically
amplify redriver nonlinearity, internal noise and crosstalks when they
reach downstream DFE and that this amplification equals the upstream
channel loss in dB. This problem can't be resolved by incremental changes
in current flow. That's why additional columns are added to impulse
response matrix in the Keysight BIRD.
BTW, there is no need to count the number of possible combinations. As
more aggressors and cascaded redrivers are added to the link, this number
will keep growing. The flow in the Keysight BIRD, described in a separate
doc, is designed in a scalable way so that one only needs to deal with 4
basic combinations and all others are automatically covered.
Fangyi
From: ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
<mailto:ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
[mailto:ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Walter Katz
Sent: Wednesday, May 03, 2017 11:40 AM
To: IBIS-ATM <ibis-macro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx <mailto:ibis-macro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> >
Subject: [ibis-macro] Fangyi and I had an AR to describe what bad things
can happen if IBIS 166.2 is approved in 7.0 and the Keysight BIRD with
additional IR is approved in IBIS 7.1 ...
All,
Fangyi and I had an AR to describe what bad things can happen if IBIS
166.2 is approved in 7.0 and the Keysight BIRD with additional IR is
approved in IBIS 7.1.
I am enclosing a presentation which is a short review of the current IBIS
166.2, and adds a section demonstrating that no bad things will happen if
166.2 is included in IBIS 7.0 and the Keysight BIRD with additional IR is
approved in IBIS 7.1.
In summary:
* There are 81 possible flows based on IBIS 6.1 models.
* There are 625 possible flows in the Keysight BIRD.
* The 81 flows in IBIS 7.0 remain the same in IBIS 7.1.
Therefore the flows in IBIS 7.1 will not change any of the flows in IBIS
7.0.
Walter
Walter Katz
<mailto:wkatz@xxxxxxxxxx> wkatz@xxxxxxxxxx
Phone 303.449-2308
Mobile 303.335-6156