[ibis-macro] Minutes from the 4 Feb 2014 ibis-atm meeting
- From: Mike LaBonte <mike@xxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: ibis-macro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2014 15:33:30 -0500
Minutes from the 4 Feb 2014 ibis-atm meeting are attached.
Mike
IBIS Macromodel Task Group
Meeting date: 04 February 2014
Members (asterisk for those attending):
Agilent: Fangyi Rao
* Radek Biernacki
Altera: David Banas
Julia Liu
Hazlina Ramly
ANSYS: Samuel Mertens
Dan Dvorscak
* Curtis Clark
Steve Pytel
Luis Armenta
Arrow Electronics: Ian Dodd
Cadence Design Systems: Terry Jernberg
* Ambrish Varma
Feras Al-Hawari
Brad Brim
Kumar Keshavan
Ken Willis
Cavium Networks: Johann Nittmann
Celsionix: Kellee Crisafulli
Cisco Systems: Ashwin Vasudevan
Syed Huq
Ericsson: Anders Ekholm
IBM: Greg Edlund
Intel: * Michael Mirmak
Maxim Integrated Products: Mahbubul Bari
Hassan Rafat
Ron Olisar
Mentor Graphics: * John Angulo
Zhen Mu
* Arpad Muranyi
Vladimir Dmitriev-Zdorov
Micron Technology: * Randy Wolff
* Justin Butterfield
NetLogic Microsystems: Ryan Couts
Nokia-Siemens Networks: Eckhard Lenski
QLogic Corp. James Zhou
Andy Joy
SiSoft: * Walter Katz
Todd Westerhoff
Doug Burns
* Mike LaBonte
Snowbush IP: Marcus Van Ierssel
ST Micro: Syed Sadeghi
Teraspeed Consulting Group: Scott McMorrow
* Bob Ross
TI: Casey Morrison
Alfred Chong
Vitesse Semiconductor: Eric Sweetman
Xilinx: Mustansir Fanaswalla
Ray Anderson
The meeting was led by Arpad Muranyi
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Opens:
- Radek: We need to discuss the overclocking issues raised at the summit.
- Arpad and Radek expressed reservations about the proposed method.
- Walter suggested power delivery macromodels for part level.
- Arpad: We should review the summit.
--------------------------
Call for patent disclosure:
- None
-------------
Review of ARs:
- None
-------------
New Discussion:
IBIS summit review:
- Arpad: It was well attended, 59 people.
- Package modeling was most interesting.
- It was suggested that Walter and Arpad should have personal meetings.
- Michael M: Ken had another proposal in his "rant".
- Ambrish: Ken asked to avoid keyword explosion.
- Walter: MCP has lots of commented keywords contained within SPICE files.
Package Proposals:
- Michael M: Do we have enough IC vendor feedback?
- Are they paying attention to what the proposed formats are?
- Walter: We should ask what they currently generate.
- Arpad:
- There are 3 common data formats: S, W, and RLC
- These can all be SPICE
- Walter:
- There are three problem classes:
- I/O, where we need to simulate channel ISI.
- Package crosstalk.
- Power delivery, a difficult modeling challenge.
- Power noise affects buffer rail voltages.
- The sum of all buffer [Composite Current]s comes from the die.
- The package needs capacitors to replenish current.
- Also some chips turn parts of the die off at times, changing the current
profile.
- SerDes power is easier to predict because it's random.
- Michael M: Do vendors need something IBIS doesn't address?
- Arpad: Feedback may be lacking due to lack of familiarity with our IBIS
keywords.
- Walter: We are not doing well getting requirements from vendors.
- Michael M: One colleague asked for clarification, no other feedback.
- Arpad: Most tools support non-IBIS package models today.
- Michael M: Is Ken Willis right?
- We do not hear many complaints from the many IBIS users.
- Arpad: IBIS still could be adding value.
- Walter: Some of our proposals could add much value.
- Mike L: We need to know what users need, and we have none present in this
meeting.
- Ambrish: Users may have what they need already.
- Walter: A good industry standard for package model delivery would pressure
the industry.
- Randy: Currently IBIS hinders the ability to get models into simulators.
- Walter: An s80p model could be extracted various ways for different purposes.
- Randy: That could work, if transparent to customers.
- Walter: It can be challenging to generate.
- Arpad: The question is if s-params will do the job.
- Michael M: Engineers will be looking for something that makes their work
easier or better.
- A "same level" solution will not do.
- Walter: Large companies will add procurement requirements for a good solution.
- Arpad: Can get get them to join us or write their requirements?
- Walter: I can get some statements.
AR: Walter collect user statements regarding their packaging needs
Tabled topics:
- Ambrish: I would like to discuss backchannel next week.
- Michael M motioned to untable BIRD 147.
- Ambrish seconded.
- No one objected.
- Radek: BIRD 128 is related.
- Michael M motioned to untable BIRD 128.
- Ambrish seconded.
- No one objected.
- Arpad: Walter has a PAM4 topic on the agenda, should we discuss that?
- Walter: We could remove it, there really is no need for it.
- Arpad removed the topic.
- Arpad: Do we still need topic 12?
- Ambrish motioned to remove it.
- Radek seconded.
- No one objected.
- Arpad: Do we still need topic 12?
- Michael M: This is still relevant.
- Walter proposed adding tabled items for overclocking and macromodel power
models.
- Arpad added these.
-------------
Next meeting: 11 February 2014 12:00pm PT
-------------
IBIS Interconnect SPICE Wish List:
1) Simulator directives
Other related posts:
- » [ibis-macro] Minutes from the 4 Feb 2014 ibis-atm meeting - Mike LaBonte
