[ibis-macro] Re: Usage Out syntax rules

  • From: "Bob Ross" <bob@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • To: <Arpad_Muranyi@xxxxxxxxxx>, <ibis-macro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • Date: Wed, 14 Dec 2011 18:26:55 -0800

All:

 

I already presented some objections to Arpad, and I see no

need for this BIRD.  I am not convinced of any technical need,

and more rules cost money in terms of more documentation,

more test cases and error codes and mistakes/delays in

developing a parser.

 

-----

 

Rule 10 should NOT be listed under Notes because it is

not a syntax rule.  It should be placed elsewhere.

 

The rule provides EDA tool guidance as to how to

handle <data> in the .ami file for a Usage Out parameter.

It should NOT be confused or misread as a syntax statement

that <data> is optional for some <data_format> cases in an

.ami file.

 

In fact, an EDA tool might opt to store the <data> for internal

data structure initialization.  So it is questionable to state

or require EDA tools to absolutely ignore <data>

 

------

 

Rule 7  adds a new restriction it is a syntactical violation

for Default to be used at all for Usage Out parameters.

 

For clarity, this must be stated as a separate rule to avoid

mixing a  set of <data_format> exceptions with Usage

exceptions.

 

Also, the full rule must also be added in one or more sections

such as where Default is given and perhaps where Out is

introduced.  The Notes are not the primary source for a rule,

but just a partial summary of restrictions noted explained

elsewhere.   Otherwise the documentation is internally

inconsistent - a problem for the parser developer.

 

Also, since and optional Default overrides <typ> in some cases

and is used in place of Value for other parameters, nothing

is gained be adding the new syntax restriction.

 

-------

 

So I do not see the value or need for this proposal.

 

Bob

 

From: ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Muranyi, Arpad
Sent: Wednesday, December 14, 2011 3:40 PM
To: ibis-macro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [ibis-macro] Re: Usage Out syntax rules

 

Hello,

 

I took the initiative and wrote a new BIRD draft to

address the issues I brought up in the email below.

(See attached file).

 

The way this BIRD is written doesn't change any of

the .ami file syntax, i.e. Usage Out parameters are

still required to contain <data>, but the BIRD states

that this data is ignored.  The other new rule I added

was to prohibit Default when the Usage is Out, since

the <data> is coming from the model, and I don't see

why we should pay attention to Default in the .ami file

when <data> is ignored anyway.

 

Please take a few minutes to review it and send me

your questions, comments, suggestions if you have any.

I would hope that this simple BIRD would not take up

much of our time, and could be submitted to the Open

Forum in a short time.

 

Thanks,

 

Arpad

========================================================

 

From: ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Muranyi, Arpad
Sent: Monday, December 12, 2011 5:38 PM
To: ibis-macro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [ibis-macro] Usage Out syntax rules

 

All,

 

I looked at BIRD 127.4 again to see what the options

might be to say something about Usage Out parameters.

I double checked, and this text applies to all parameters,

Reserved and Model_Specific:

 

|*              All parameters must be in the following format:

|*

|*              (parameter_name (Usage <usage>)

|*                              (Type <data_type>)

|*                              ({Format} <data_format> <data>)

|*                              (Default <value>)

|*                              (Description <string>))

 

There is another rule that Default and Format Value can't

coexist in the same parameter.  All other Formats are

allowed to have Default.  We could possibly refine/revise

the notes below this syntax definition.  Here are the

relevant notes which could be considered:

 

|*              4) The <data_format> selection of Value and Default are

|*                 always mutually exclusive.  Certain parameters may
require

|*                 Value or Default, but Value and Default are not allowed
to

|*                  be present together for the same parameter.

|*              5) <data_format> is always required for selections other

|*                 than Value.

|*              6) Default is optional for <data_format> Range, List,
Corner, 

|*                 Increment and Steps.

|*              7) Default is not allowed for <data_format> Table, Gaussian,

|*                 Dual-Dirac and DjRj.

 

We should probably state that for Usage Out,

-   Default is not allowed

-   Format Value is not allowed

-   and <data> shall be omitted for all other <data_format>s.

 

Table poses an interesting exception.  According to BIRD 132,

tables of Usage Out are still required to contain a single row

of data, so that the tool would know how many columns are in a

row when it reads the flattened data coming from the model.

 

Questions, comments, suggestions are welcome.

 

Thanks,

 

Arpad

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