This looks good to me. Do I remember Ian volunteered to make copies (or have them made)? Any comments or changes, please respond by 5PM (EST) today - no replies by then, we release the file for duplication. Bob, I will forward a .pdf separately for posting on the web site. Todd. Todd Westerhoff High Speed Design Group Manager Cisco Systems 1414 Massachusetts Ave Boxboro, MA 01719 email:twesterh@xxxxxxxxx ph: 978-936-2149 ____________________________________________ "Always do right. This will gratify some people and astonish the rest." - Mark Twain -----Original Message----- From: ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Mike LaBonte (milabont) Sent: Thursday, February 02, 2006 10:08 AM To: ibis-macro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: [ibis-macro] Re: Epiphany Here is Todd's presentation with the last 2 slides deleted and the VA/VHD/SPICE code snippets on slide 8 revised to reflect the real languages. I had to use an ellipses to make VHDL fit. Mike -----Original Message----- From: ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Todd Westerhoff (twesterh) Sent: Wednesday, February 01, 2006 4:49 PM To: ibis-macro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: [ibis-macro] Re: Epiphany Okay, fair enough. Let's try the attached. It may not be as intriguing as the earlier version, but it still gets the point across ... and I like avoiding the entanglement of being seen as making representations about EDA tools. Again, comments are welcome and appreciated. Todd. P.S. The last two slides go away for the published version - I just avoided deleting it until we agree we want it gone. Todd Westerhoff High Speed Design Group Manager Cisco Systems 1414 Massachusetts Ave Boxboro, MA 01719 email:twesterh@xxxxxxxxx ph: 978-936-2149 ____________________________________________ "Always do right. This will gratify some people and astonish the rest." - Mark Twain -----Original Message----- From: Bob Ross [mailto:bob@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] Sent: Wednesday, February 01, 2006 4:12 PM To: Todd Westerhoff (twesterh) Cc: ibis-macro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: Re: [ibis-macro] Re: Epiphany Todd: The presentation content (especially with vendor names needs to be clear. While your intent seems reasonable, it is more important to be absolutely clear and non-judgemental regarding and vendor name. Verbal clarification is insufficient for published material. Without clarification, the blank leaves a negative connotation for those vendors listed. That is why you should either clarify, remove the names, disquise the names, (vendor 1, vendor 2), or add the substitution checks as a reasonalbe alternative. This is the issue. Be careful what you say when you list vendor names. Or remove that slide entirely. Bob Todd Westerhoff (twesterh) wrote: > The question of "what do we do for the vendors where everything is > blank?" is EXACTLY what I want the viewer to ask. There are two > questions that should arise from the slide: > > 1) If we pick Verilog-A, what about the VHDL-AMS only vendors? > 2) No matter what we pick, what about vendors without -A or -AMS > support? > > Remember the slide appears before we introduce the macro approach, as > part of the description of the problem. I'm suggesting that our > approach to multiple language support arises in response to the > natural questions posed by slide 4. > > I'll change the slide if the group wants, but I actually think it's > simpler and more straightforward this way ("this is the problem we > were up against"). The other thing that deleting the substitution > column did was eliminate the issue of whether we were declaring > vendor's future plans or not. The slide simply shows current tool > language support as represented by the vendors. > > Comments are welcome and appreciated. > > Todd. > > Todd Westerhoff > High Speed Design Group Manager > Cisco Systems > 1414 Massachusetts Ave > Boxboro, MA 01719 > email:twesterh@xxxxxxxxx > ph: 978-936-2149 > ____________________________________________ > "Always do right. > This will gratify some people and astonish the rest." > > - Mark Twain > > > -----Original Message----- > From: ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > [mailto:ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Muranyi, Arpad > Sent: Wednesday, February 01, 2006 12:04 PM > To: ibis-macro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > Subject: [ibis-macro] Re: Epiphany > > I tend to agree with Bob's opinion that something should be mentioned > about substitution on that chart. > It looks empty this way begging the question why those vendors/tools > are listed then... > > Arpad > ====================================================== > > -----Original Message----- > From: ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > [mailto:ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Bob Ross > Sent: Wednesday, February 01, 2006 9:01 AM > To: twesterh@xxxxxxxxx > Cc: ibis-macro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > Subject: [ibis-macro] Re: Epiphany > > Todd: > > Details - should put your name as author since this will be stored as > westerhoff.pdf, etc. > > Looks OK, but not clear why two vendors are listed with no checks. > need some footnote or explaination that they would probably use a > SPICE mapping solution (substitution), but still could be supported. > > Slide 11 - ok, but could correct the syntax in the boxes, but not > critical. > > Bob > > Todd Westerhoff (twesterh) wrote: > > >>Take a look at slide 4. >> >>It occurred to me that the vendor / tool / language matrix was better >>suited to describing why we picked the approach we did. As such, I've > > >>removed the "substitution" column and moved it forward in the > > presentation. > >> >>- It now explains why we picked Verilog-A as our initial >>implementation language (most tool support) >>- It also explains why we needed VHDL-AMS support (key vendor support) >>- Adding Sigrity and Apsim shows why we needed a substitution scheme >>and, by extension, adherence to basic SPICE element types >> >>Comments are welcome and appreciated. >> >>Todd. >> >>Todd Westerhoff >>High Speed Design Group Manager >>Cisco Systems >>1414 Massachusetts Ave >>Boxboro, MA 01719 >>email:twesterh@xxxxxxxxx >>ph: 978-936-2149 >>____________________________________________ >>"Always do right. >> This will gratify some people and astonish the rest." >> >>- Mark Twain >> > > > -- > Bob Ross > Teraspeed Consulting Group LLC Teraspeed Labs > 121 North River Drive 13610 SW Harness Lane > Narragansett, RI 02882 Beaverton, OR 97008 > 401-284-1827 503-430-1065 > http://www.teraspeed.com 503-246-8048 Direct > bob@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > > Teraspeed is a registered service mark of Teraspeed Consulting Group > LLC > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > IBIS Macro website: http://www.sisoft.com/ibis-macro IBIS Macro > archives: //www.freelists.org/archives/ibis-macro > To unsubscribe send an email: > To: ibis-macro-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > Subject: unsubscribe > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > IBIS Macro website: http://www.sisoft.com/ibis-macro IBIS Macro > archives: //www.freelists.org/archives/ibis-macro > To unsubscribe send an email: > To: ibis-macro-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > Subject: unsubscribe > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > IBIS Macro website: http://www.sisoft.com/ibis-macro IBIS Macro > archives: //www.freelists.org/archives/ibis-macro > To unsubscribe send an email: > To: ibis-macro-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > Subject: unsubscribe > -- Bob Ross Teraspeed Consulting Group LLC Teraspeed Labs 121 North River Drive 13610 SW Harness Lane Narragansett, RI 02882 Beaverton, OR 97008 401-284-1827 503-430-1065 http://www.teraspeed.com 503-246-8048 Direct bob@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Teraspeed is a registered service mark of Teraspeed Consulting Group LLC --------------------------------------------------------------------- IBIS Macro website: http://www.sisoft.com/ibis-macro IBIS Macro archives: //www.freelists.org/archives/ibis-macro To unsubscribe send an email: To: ibis-macro-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: unsubscribe