Hi Ray, This is one of the replies that didn't get to my mailbox. Thanks for pointing this behavior out. I hadn't thought that far beyond the look, but now with better seat grip and some riding experience, I can say that the arms have so many functions, and across a large range of motion, from ground operations, mid-air balancing, gadget operations, and head support / resting. A python handlebar would have to follow the arm motion, plus conventional functions like steering, mounting rear mirror, brake levers, gear changer, light, horn, and gadgets. Now imagine to be a person without arms (Yepp trike), bionic arms would be need to ride a python, with all of the goodies on board... Vi ---------- http://www.rjs.org/gallery/python_2.jpg it is absolutely unridable; the arm and hip forces are exactly opposite. In retrospect, I thought that a linked bar (opposite steerer) might therefore be useable, but changing the pivot angle to 65 made all the difference. Ray