[sib-access] Re: The current state of accessibility in Sibelius 7.51 Please read carefully!
- From: Kevin Gibbs <kevjazz@xxxxxx>
- To: "sib-access@xxxxxxxxxxxxx" <sib-access@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2014 15:05:22 -0500
Guys,
I really need you all to be patient. Please do not upgrade from Sibelius 5.25
to 7.51. In absolutely no event will you receive an upgrade in accessibility
and performance.
For those of you who have Win7 on your computers, and can run in XP
compatibility mode, it would be ideal if you can have both Sibelius 7.51 and
5.25 available on the same machine.
As I write this, the product manager for Sibelius, Sam Butler, is out of the
office until September 29. I sent him our finished accessibility oriented
documentation with the understanding that he was going to put it on Avitts
website for public distribution. This has not yet been done. When it is, I
will inform you of the link and encourage all of you to go and read this
documentation,which you will be able to do without purchasing the product.
Once you have All read the documentation thoroughly, you can make an informed
decision as to whether Sibelius 7.51 is right for you.
If any of you have specific questions reply to this message and I will do my
best to answer them as time permits.
There is one critical thing that you all need to understand before you consider
upgrading to 7.51. The installation and authorization process for 7.51 is
absolutely inaccessible. It is not possible to do this without sighted
assistance. Gord was able to actually do it. But the process involved a
combination of jaws, OCR, NVDA, and a bunch of other hacks. But we have decided
that the steps involved are absolutely impossible to document. Therefore, it
is absolutely not recommended that a totally sightless person attempt to
authorize Sibelius 7.51 without sighted assistance. PERIOD!
Kevin
Sent from my iPhone
On Sep 17, 2014, at 1:47 PM, Chris Smart <csmart8@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> oh i trust you, no worries. (grin) just pushing for as many tiny
> details as possible. :)
>
> At 02:41 PM 9/17/2014, you wrote:
>> Gord has done his best with Python. NVDA folks are not as yet
>> involved. I think the best route to go is to have the Avid folks
>> continue working on it. I have lines to engineers and others over
>> there. Trust us. We're on it. Okay?
>> On Sep 17, 2014, at 12:57 PM, Chris Smart wrote:
>>
>>> Kevin, are the NVDA folks aware of this as well? Can anything be done
>>> with some sort of NVDA add-on? I gather this involves knowing some python.
>>>
>>> At 01:49 PM 9/17/2014, you wrote:
>>>> Wait a minute before you upgrade. Everyone on this list read what
>>>> I'm about to say very carefully, please!
>>>>
>>>> The accessibility available in Sibelius 7.51 is not as good as we
>>>> have been used to in 5.25, or for those of us who had the beta
>>>> scripts for 6.20. For example, it is not possible to know whether a
>>>> note has an articulation mark attached to it. hairpins and slurs
>>>> can be attached. But, when reviewing a score, NVDA will
>>>> consistently misreport the start and end point of a hairpin or slur.
>>>>
>>>> Gord has written a section in our documentation explaining what can
>>>> and can't be done when writing lyrics under music.
>>>>
>>>> The mixer is still completely inaccessible.
>>>>
>>>> Please wait until our documentation is posted on the Avid
>>>> website. You will be able to read this documentation without
>>>> purchasing the product. I can't recommend reading this
>>>> documentation strongly enough before, yes, that's before you
>>>> purchase Sibelius 7.51. Accessibility is definitely a work in
>>>> progress and you will probably be sorely disappointed if you migrate
>>>> from 5.25 to 7.51, as the level of accessibility in 7.51 is nowhere
>>>> near what we have in 5.25. Future versions will improve this. But
>>>> you need to have no illusions about the current state of accessibility.
>>>>
>>>> Kevin
>>>> On Sep 17, 2014, at 12:09 PM, Chris Smart wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Kevin. Thank you! That is some of the best news I've heard in months!
>>>>> I'd better upgrade to Sib7 then. (grin)
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> At 11:11 AM 9/17/2014, you wrote:
>>>>>> Guys,
>>>>>> This may be as good a time as any to let a cat out of the bag.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Gordon Kent and I have been working closely with the folks at Avid
>>>>>> to enhance accessibility in Sibelius 7.51. It may be completely
>>>>>> coincidental that Avid has decided not to offer downgrades. But we
>>>>>> will be offering some special blind centric documentation for
>>>>>> Sibelius 7.51 and NVDA very soon. No JFW or scripts needed.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Watch this space in the next month or so.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Kevin
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Sep 17, 2014, at 9:37 AM, Tim Burgess <tim@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Me too.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I've sent a message to the product manager - I've got an automated
>>>>>>> out-of-office reply, but I know that this chap will respond
>> as soon as he
>>>>>>> possibly can.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Best wishes.
>>>>>>> Tim Burgess
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>> From: sib-access-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>>> [mailto:sib-access-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Chi Kim
>>>>>>> Sent: 17 September 2014 15:20
>>>>>>> To: sib-access@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>>> Subject: [sib-access] Re: Problem: Avid Won't Downgrade Sibelius 7 to
>>>>>>> Sibelius 5 Anymore
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Tim, thanks for investigating. Please keep us updated.
>>>>>>> I really hope I'm wrong about this.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Chi
>>>>>>> On 9/17/2014 9:28 AM, Tim Burgess wrote:
>>>>>>>> Hi,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I'm querying this state of affairs via my contacts within
>> Avid and will
>>>>>>> post
>>>>>>>> a definitive statement from them as and when I receive a reply.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Best wishes.
>>>>>>>> Tim Burgess
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>> From: sib-access-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>>>> [mailto:sib-access-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Chi Kim
>>>>>>>> Sent: 17 September 2014 13:27
>>>>>>>> To: sib-access@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>>>> Subject: [sib-access] Problem: Avid Won't Downgrade Sibelius 7
>>>> to Sibelius
>>>>>>> 5
>>>>>>>> Anymore
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> HI All,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> This is a sad news. I just talked to Avid tech support last Friday to
>>>>>>>> help one of my students, and they won't let you downgrade anymore.
>>>>>>>> The tech support told me that he cannot generate a new serial for
>>>>>>>> Sibelius 5 apparently.
>>>>>>>> He was aware of the accessibility with Sibelius 5 and the script. I
>>>>>>>> suspect this is going to be a huge problem now for new users.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Chi
>>>>>>>>
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