[ddots-l] Re: putting together backing tracks
- From: "Phil Muir" <info@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: <ddots-l@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>, <midimag@xxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Fri, 23 Jul 2010 11:43:47 +0100
Damon wrote:
OK, so I am sitting here contemplating this solo project thing. And I have
some general ideas, but would really like some help from those of you doing
this kind of thing.
My goal is to put together sets of music that I play along to. Either I play
the tracks from my newly acquired Zoom h4n or I use my laptop. Not sure
which yet.
Phil replied: got rid of the laptop here as that also meant I had to carry a
separate external sound card. Way too much gear and trouble. Now
exclusively use the Zoom for playing out the tracks.
Damon wrote: The tracks will be rock and roll based, generally from the 60s
through today, probably with a larger emphasis on 70s and 80s and some 90s
and some modern, although I won't rule out a beetles song or whatnot.
Phil replied: we do everything from, Jonny Be Good, through to a couple of
beetles tunes, and tracks such as "Dancing In The Streets", "Take Me To The
River", "Aint no Stoppin Us now, through to Crowded House, "Take The Weather
With You", "Long Train Runnin" Talk Talk, "It's My Life" and newer stuff
like "The Sizzer Sisters, "Take You're Mama." Mind you, we are a duo so
Sarah, does some of the girly tunes.
Damon wrote: My weapons of choice for recording the tracks include sonar
8.5.3 lots of effects, superior drummer as a plug-in for drums, trilian for
bass, my motif xs7 run through a line6 pod x3 live or gear box for guitars,
plus all my hardware like the motif, pc3, ord rack 2x and soft synths like
b4, pro53, fm7, dimension pro, rapture and god knows what else I have here.
Phil replied: cool!
So, my problems are like this. IN putting together tracks, I am trying not
to go too far into overproduced land, so no doubling backing vocals, trying
not to over arrange things, basically making it drums, bass, one or two
guitars, and enough keyboard parts that can be officially pulled off live. I
don't want it to sound too canned, I want it to have a live feel to it. So,
there'd be no more than 2 harmony parts in addition to what I sing. I plan
on going one step further with this live and actually doing guitar oriented
stuff using my Roland ax1 shoulder controller for the guitar stuff, like say
I want to do Talk dirty to me by poison, I'd literally play it on a keytar
including the solos using a motif xs7 guitar patch going through my pod.
Phil replied: all sounds cool to me. We do have double backing vocals on
tunes such as "We Are Family." Thickens up the sound a bit. Also, we have
a couple of deliberate wholes in the stereo mix. One on the left for
Sarah's acoustic guitar
, and one on the right for my Vox Tonelab SE with my G&L electric. If I mix
it right then, it sound like a full band and you can't tell where the
backing track ends and the live playing begins. People like it because they
think it's like going to see a full band play live. I also mention the fact
that all of the tracks have been put together by us in the studio. This has
prompted some enquiries by musicians about getting tracks done.
Damon wrote: Now. My biggest issue is finding the right drum sound for
superior drummer. I don't know if I should make it sound like big room or
more tight. I have always liked a big room drum sound. Plus, should I tailor
the drum sound for each song. Say I am going to do are you gonna go my way
by lenny kravitz. That's a different sound on the drum compared to 25 our 6
2 4 by Chicago, which is different than cult of personality by living color,
which is different to some beetles track. So, should I get one template drum
sound or tailor them to each song? I am worried about it sounding too much
like karaoke and want it to sound like it would if there were musicians
behind me. So, what's the best way to go about making this sound that way?
Phil replied: personally I would fire up Superior with multiple outputs. I
would then, simply swap out the snare and high-hats for each tune. I would
archive the ambient mics as you will get enough room off the overhead mics.
I wouldn't go for too big a drum sound as you could potentially be playing
in a large room that has lots of echo at some point in you're career. If
you want an even quicker way to do this, use one of the Sonar project/track
drum templates for Superior that I sent you as part of you're Superior
Drummer 2 HSC purchase. One of the templates have EQ, compression etc for
all of the drums, already set-up.
Damon wrote: Also, what kind of PA requirements would I need for something
like this? I currently only use one Mackie srm monitor. I wonder if that
would be enough? It's got a 12 inch woofer and a horn tweeter. Put it on a
stand, maybe it'd be good, but it wouldn't be stereo. I know that doesn't
matter, I am not going to pan my tracks left and right. But should I try
something else
Phil replied: try it and see. Depending on the size of the gig, we use 2
or, 4 EVSX 200's on stands and will at some point, be getting separate bass
bins. Mind you, we mix in stereo. That's for the front of house mix. We
also run two sub mixes for in ear monitoring on a Behrenger headphone amp.
If you're going to use one speaker then, you will want to hit the mono
button on the master bus in Sonar before exporting you're tracks.
Otherwise, you may miss off some of those panned cymbals in Superior.
Damon wrote: Also, effects? Record vocals dry or not?
Phil replied: depends on the tune. If we do use reverb then, it's not much.
Damon wrote: Lastly, am I barking up the wrong tree with this kind of
material? I don't really want to do atypical set of Billy Joel and Elton
john and all light stuff. I want to do some of that, but I also want to rock
out a bit and do things most people would never expect a keyboard player to
do. I just want it to be believeable and not sound like karaoke. So, any
suggestions and I'd love you for ever.
Phil replied: you will know you're market better ahn any of us. Think you
may need to think about what you're known for. In our case, it's high
quality backing tracks with tight vocals and guitars. Perhaps you're doing
guitar on keys, could be the selling point.
Damon wrote: If I think of other questions, I'll throw them in, but this is
probably too much as it is.
Phil replied: that's fine. Keep on asking and we shall send you back
thoughts.
Regards, Phil Muir
Accessibility Training
Telephone: US (615) 713-2021
UK +44-1747-821-794
Mobile: UK +44-7968-136-246
E-mail:
info@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
URL:
http://www.accessibilitytraining.co.uk/
Other related posts:
