[mac4theblind] Re: help on help!
- From: "Julio C. Perez" <jcperez11@xxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: mac4theblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Date: Tue, 06 Mar 2012 22:43:47 -0500
No, now all is well. resetting to defaults for both VO and safari has returned
me to the place I knew before. I have also starting playing around with the
activities options of VO so as to save the latest best working environment. At
least, I think this is the feature I can use to do this.
On Mar 6, 2012, at 10:23 PM, Sarah Alawami wrote:
> So now that you reset your vo settings? can you now access the show hide
> clickable items that you were having trouble accessing? or are they still not
> accessible to your voice over? If that's the case it looks like it's time for
> either permissions repair or a reinstall of the os, but I really hope that's
> not the case as both are annoying.
> On Mar 6, 2012, at 4:15 PM, George B <gbmagoo@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
>> Lol I think the subject line could be changed by now, please.
>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: mac4theblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:mac4theblind-
>>> bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Julio C. Perez
>>> Sent: Tuesday, March 06, 2012 15:29
>>> To: mac4theblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> Subject: [mac4theblind] Re: help on help!
>>>
>>> So now I've got VO reset to the initial defaults. I'm going to look
>>> around the VO utility and check out how things are set.
>>> On Mar 6, 2012, at 6:38 AM, David Hilbert Poehlman wrote:
>>>
>>>> you can reset vo by opening the vo utility with vo-f8 and activating
>>> the reset all voiceover preferences menu item under the file menu.
>>>>
>>>> Slow down, read carefully, talk to apple, don't get frustrated.
>>> Thousands of us are able to use vo just fine and you will be too as
>>> soon as you *grasp* it.
>>>>
>>>> On Mar 5, 2012, at 10:33 PM, Julio C. Perez wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Ok, so I have all the commanders turned off (including the touch-pad
>>> commander). Same non-results.
>>>> On Mar 5, 2012, at 10:21 PM, Julio C. Perez wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I have also tried with the keyboard commander and num-pad commanders
>>> off with the same non-results. So it is the same with or without quick-
>>> nav, keyboard or num-pad commanders. Is there a way of repairing or
>>> reinstalling safari? VoiceOver? Is there a way of resetting either of
>>> these to their default settings? Maybe I've mis-configured one or the
>>> other into garbage.
>>>>> On Mar 5, 2012, at 8:20 AM, David Hilbert Poehlman wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> I wonder if somehow you are triggering quick nav? press the left
>>> and right arrow keys together to toggle quick nav. make sure it is
>>> turned off before you vo click show.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Mar 4, 2012, at 10:17 PM, "Julio C. Perez"
>>> <jcperez11@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> No, this isn't working on my system at this time. I have had this
>>> work in the not too distant past but it isn't working now.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Is safari the only browser that works under the Mac OS with
>>> voiceover?
>>>>>> On Mar 4, 2012, at 8:02 PM, David Hilbert Poehlman wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> vo right arrow after clicking show.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Mar 4, 2012, at 2:06 PM, Julio C. Perez wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Weird and frustrating! In detail.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 1. I select the link "voiceover basics". This takes me to a
>>> content list with seven items. I can either navigate to one of those
>>> links (lets say the "selecting a sigle item" link) or open the contents
>>> list by interacting with it and then arrowing down to the link. In
>>> either case, the result is the same. A list of "show" clickable items
>>> appears which when clicked on does not display text information but
>>> only changes the "show" option to a "hide" option.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The VO-shift-up arrow WILL stop interacting with the current item
>>> every time. I've also used the quick nab left-down arrow and the num-
>>> pad #7. The problem is not with the interaction. The problem is that
>>> the explanatory text never appears. or maybe it does but I don't know
>>> where.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I'm going to check with the Apple Accessibility folks and see what
>>> they can add to the mix.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Thanks to you and all for all of your help so far.
>>>>>>> On Mar 4, 2012, at 1:35 PM, David Hilbert Poehlman wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> looking at this again, something weird is going on here because
>>> are describing something you are interacting with and vo-shift-up arrow
>>> should stop interacting. vo right and left arrow move through the
>>> text.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Mar 4, 2012, at 1:31 PM, Julio C. Perez wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> This exploration is yielding lots of new knowledge. I've now know
>>> about the quick nab feature and how to use the various combination of
>>> arrow keys to control safari operations. Unfortunately, my basic
>>> original problem remains. Oh well. back to the front!
>>>>>>>> On Mar 4, 2012, at 11:38 AM, David Hilbert Poehlman wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> sorry, this is the stop interacting key and it sounded like you
>>> were interacting with something.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On Mar 4, 2012, at 10:24 AM, Julio C. Perez wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> If I press "cvo-shift-up arrow"Do you mean "command-VO-shift-up
>>> arrow"? cause if I do this it has the effect of moving the VO cursor
>>> up.
>>>>>>>>> On Mar 3, 2012, at 2:33 PM, David Hilbert Poehlman wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> press cvo-shift-up arrow and then try vo-right.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> On Mar 3, 2012, at 1:27 PM, Julio C. Perez wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> VO-left or right arrows only take me (line by line) to the top
>>> or bottom of the object I'm interacting with. Either links to other
>>> topics or groups. Not explanatory text.
>>>>>>>>>> On Mar 3, 2012, at 1:04 PM, John Panarese wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> If you vo space on the clickable item, try navigating right
>>> with the VO and right arrow keys. See if that reveals anything for
>>> you.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Take Care
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> John D. Panarese
>>>>>>>>>>> Director
>>>>>>>>>>> Mac for the Blind
>>>>>>>>>>> john@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.macfortheblind.com
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> AUTHORIZED APPLE STORE BUSINESS AFFILIATE
>>>>>>>>>>> MAC VOICEOVER TRAINING AND SUPPORT
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> On Mar 3, 2012, at 1:02 PM, "Julio C. Perez"
>>> <jcperez11@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks John for the detailed clarification. I guess I did not
>>> get it when David said it the first time. I can get back to the proper
>>> window within the application by using the command-f2 twice.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Now I can get back to the issue I started this thread with.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> So here I am in the help topic that is supposed to explain
>>> how to select and deselect single and multiple items. I have here a
>>> list of clickable objects that say "show" group with two items. When I
>>> interact with the group, I find two clickable items within (as
>>> expected). When I click on the "show" clickable, I expect to get to
>>> some text or html window that explains how to do this. The only thing I
>>> seem to find is that there now appears a "hide" clickable. Where do I
>>> go to find the instructions for selecting or deselecting one or more
>>> items? The window chooser command only gives me the "help" and
>>> "utilities" child windows. Could this have something to do with the
>>> navigational mode or something?
>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mar 3, 2012, at 12:40 PM, John Panarese wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> The command-accent combination, which is the key below the
>>> escape key, will cycle you through open windows in an application.
>>> Command-tab cycles you through your open applications. For the help,
>>> try the command-accent or David's suggestion of using the window
>>> chooser menu with VO-F2 twice and then using the up and down arrows to
>>> see a list of your currently open windows.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Take Care
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> John D. Panarese
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Director
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mac for the Blind
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Tel, (631) 724-4479
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Email, john@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Website, http://www.macfortheblind.com
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> AUTHORIZED APPLE STORE BUSINESS AFFILIATE
>>>>>>>>>>>>> MAC and iOS VOICEOVER TRAINING AND SUPPORT
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mar 3, 2012, at 12:36 PM, George B wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> hummmm what is a grave key, please??
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: mac4theblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> [mailto:mac4theblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of
>>> Tracy Duffy
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Saturday, March 03, 2012 09:32
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To: mac4theblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: [mac4theblind] Re: help on help!
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> You can also try command along with the grav key. This will
>>> move you from
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> window to window within an application. At least it does in
>>> Snowleopard.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mar 3, 2012, at 12:30 PM, George B wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> good job david i am not on my mac and could not remember
>>> that command
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: mac4theblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> [mailto:mac4theblind-
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of David Hilbert Poehlman
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Saturday, March 03, 2012 09:27
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To: mac4theblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: [mac4theblind] Re: help on help!
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> try vo-f2 twice to bring up a list of open windows.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mar 3, 2012, at 12:18 PM, Julio C. Perez wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> So, when I press command-tab twice, it doesn't bring me to
>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> previously open help topic I left. It only switches me to
>>> the other
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> application windows or brings me back to the same VO
>>> utilities window.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> If I go to the menu and arrow down the windows options, I
>>> only see one
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> applications window available to choose from. Is one of
>>> those other
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> options on that windows drop-down the one I need to take me
>>> back to the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> topic I left? How does one switch to different windows
>>> within an
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> application window?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mar 3, 2012, at 12:00 PM, David Hilbert Poehlman wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> try command-tab twice.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mar 3, 2012, at 11:47 AM, George B wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> First of all command tab changes your application from one
>>> to another
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> not
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> windows within a application.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: mac4theblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> [mailto:mac4theblind-
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Julio C. Perez
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Saturday, March 03, 2012 08:44
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To: mac4theblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: [mac4theblind] Re: help on help!
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Ok, here is an example..
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I am currently in a help window that has . here is an even
>>> better
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> example of not having a clue of something that should be
>>> (and needs
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> be) understood by a neophyte.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> As I am writing this message, I switch to another window
>>> where I'm
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> working with a help topic. I switch back to this window to
>>> write
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> something and when I use the "command-tab" hoping to return
>>> to the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> help
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> window. I end up back in the VoiceOver utilities area. Not
>>> the help
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> topic I thought I would be going to. How do I make this
>>> simple
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> switch
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> from one window to another without having to navigate back
>>> to the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> topic
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> layer after linked layer?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> This is the sort of thing that I never had to think about
>>> before.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mar 3, 2012, at 11:24 AM, David Hilbert Poehlman wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> can you give us an example? I believe I know what you need
>>> to do
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> but
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rather than searching through help for an item, it would
>>> speed up
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> process having an example.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mar 3, 2012, at 11:16 AM, Julio C. Perez wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It seems like the more I think I've learned, the more I
>>> know I've
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> missed!
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Right now I'm going through the VoiceOver help menu seeking
>>> areas
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> weak on and hoping to learn more. When I get to a "show"
>>> clickable
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> object, I select it. and nothing seems to happen except
>>> that it
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> changes
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> from a "show" to a "hide" area. Where does the related
>>> information
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> get
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> shown? What part of this process am I not getting?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I can freely admit that navigation and safari navigation in
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> particular are my weakest areas. This makes learning via
>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> provided
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> help topics slow. Does anyone know of a good tutorial for
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> transplanted
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> windows/internet explorer/JAWS users? I mean, there should
>>> be enough
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> us by now to have, at least, an email list that can serve
>>> as a place
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> trade and ask for information that might bore those of you
>>> for whom
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> mac environment is natural.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> /jp, mac user without papers!************
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> You are subscribed to the mac4theblind mailing list.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The url for this list, where one can unsubscribe or make
>>> any
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> changes to their list subscription is:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> //www.freelists.org/list/mac4theblind
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The list archive is located at
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> //www.freelists.org/archive/mac4theblind/
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> All emails intended for the list owner can be sent to:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> john@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Jonnie Appleseed
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> With His
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hands-On Technolog(eye)s
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Touching The Internet
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Reducing Technology's disabilities
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> One Byte At A Tie
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ************
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> You are subscribed to the mac4theblind mailing list.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The url for this list, where one can unsubscribe or make
>>> any
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> changes to their list subscription is:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> //www.freelists.org/list/mac4theblind
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The list archive is located at
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> //www.freelists.org/archive/mac4theblind/
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> All emails intended for the list owner can be sent to:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> john@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ************
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> You are subscribed to the mac4theblind mailing list.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The url for this list, where one can unsubscribe or make
>>> any
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> changes to their list subscription is:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> //www.freelists.org/list/mac4theblind
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The list archive is located at
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> //www.freelists.org/archive/mac4theblind/
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> All emails intended for the list owner can be sent to:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> john@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ************
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> You are subscribed to the mac4theblind mailing list.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The url for this list, where one can unsubscribe or make
>>> any
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> changes to their list subscription is:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> //www.freelists.org/list/mac4theblind
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The list archive is located at
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> //www.freelists.org/archive/mac4theblind/
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> All emails intended for the list owner can be sent to:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> john@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Jonnie Appleseed
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> With His
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hands-On Technolog(eye)s
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Touching The Internet
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Reducing Technology's disabilities
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> One Byte At A Tie
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ************
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> You are subscribed to the mac4theblind mailing list.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The url for this list, where one can unsubscribe or make
>>> any
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> changes to their list subscription is:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> //www.freelists.org/list/mac4theblind
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The list archive is located at
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> //www.freelists.org/archive/mac4theblind/
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> All emails intended for the list owner can be sent to:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> john@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ************
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> You are subscribed to the mac4theblind mailing list.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The url for this list, where one can unsubscribe or make
>>> any
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> changes to their list subscription is:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> //www.freelists.org/list/mac4theblind
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The list archive is located at
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> //www.freelists.org/archive/mac4theblind/
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> All emails intended for the list owner can be sent to:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> john@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Jonnie Appleseed
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> With His
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hands-On Technolog(eye)s
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Touching The Internet
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Reducing Technology's disabilities
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> One Byte At A Tie
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ************
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> You are subscribed to the mac4theblind mailing list.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The url for this list, where one can unsubscribe or make
>>> any
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> changes to their list subscription is:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> //www.freelists.org/list/mac4theblind
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The list archive is located at
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> //www.freelists.org/archive/mac4theblind/
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> All emails intended for the list owner can be sent to:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> john@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ************
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> You are subscribed to the mac4theblind mailing list.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The url for this list, where one can unsubscribe or make
>>> any changes to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> their list subscription is:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> //www.freelists.org/list/mac4theblind
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The list archive is located at
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> //www.freelists.org/archive/mac4theblind/
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> All emails intended for the list owner can be sent to:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> john@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> tracyduffy@xxxxxxxxx
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Isaiah 2:11 Human pride will be brought down,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and human arrogance will be humbled.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Only the LORD will be exalted
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> on that day of judgment.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> ************
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> You are subscribed to the mac4theblind mailing list.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> The url for this list, where one can unsubscribe or make any
>>> changes to their list subscription is:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> //www.freelists.org/list/mac4theblind
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> The list archive is located at
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> //www.freelists.org/archive/mac4theblind/
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> All emails intended for the list owner can be sent to:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> john@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> ************
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> You are subscribed to the mac4theblind mailing list.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> The url for this list, where one can unsubscribe or make any
>>> changes to their list subscription is:
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> //www.freelists.org/list/mac4theblind
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> The list archive is located at
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> //www.freelists.org/archive/mac4theblind/
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> All emails intended for the list owner can be sent to:
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> john@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ************
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> You are subscribed to the mac4theblind mailing list.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> The url for this list, where one can unsubscribe or make any
>>> changes to their list subscription is:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> //www.freelists.org/list/mac4theblind
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> The list archive is located at
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> //www.freelists.org/archive/mac4theblind/
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> All emails intended for the list owner can be sent to:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> john@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> ************
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> You are subscribed to the mac4theblind mailing list.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> The url for this list, where one can unsubscribe or make any
>>> changes to their list subscription is:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> //www.freelists.org/list/mac4theblind
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> The list archive is located at
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> //www.freelists.org/archive/mac4theblind/
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> All emails intended for the list owner can be sent to:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> john@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>> Jonnie Appleseed
>>>>>>>>>> With His
>>>>>>>>>> Hands-On Technolog(eye)s
>>>>>>>>>> Touching The Internet
>>>>>>>>>> Reducing Technology's disabilities
>>>>>>>>>> One Byte At A Tie
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> ************
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> You are subscribed to the mac4theblind mailing list.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> The url for this list, where one can unsubscribe or make any
>>> changes to their list subscription is:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> //www.freelists.org/list/mac4theblind
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> The list archive is located at
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> //www.freelists.org/archive/mac4theblind/
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> All emails intended for the list owner can be sent to:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> john@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ************
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> You are subscribed to the mac4theblind mailing list.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The url for this list, where one can unsubscribe or make any
>>> changes to their list subscription is:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> //www.freelists.org/list/mac4theblind
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The list archive is located at
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> //www.freelists.org/archive/mac4theblind/
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> All emails intended for the list owner can be sent to:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> john@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>> Jonnie Appleseed
>>>>>>>>> With His
>>>>>>>>> Hands-On Technolog(eye)s
>>>>>>>>> Touching The Internet
>>>>>>>>> Reducing Technology's disabilities
>>>>>>>>> One Byte At A Tie
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ************
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> You are subscribed to the mac4theblind mailing list.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The url for this list, where one can unsubscribe or make any
>>> changes to their list subscription is:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> //www.freelists.org/list/mac4theblind
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The list archive is located at
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> //www.freelists.org/archive/mac4theblind/
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> All emails intended for the list owner can be sent to:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> john@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ************
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> You are subscribed to the mac4theblind mailing list.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The url for this list, where one can unsubscribe or make any
>>> changes to their list subscription is:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> //www.freelists.org/list/mac4theblind
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The list archive is located at
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> //www.freelists.org/archive/mac4theblind/
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> All emails intended for the list owner can be sent to:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> john@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>> Jonnie Appleseed
>>>>>>>> With His
>>>>>>>> Hands-On Technolog(eye)s
>>>>>>>> Touching The Internet
>>>>>>>> Reducing Technology's disabilities
>>>>>>>> One Byte At A Tie
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ************
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> You are subscribed to the mac4theblind mailing list.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The url for this list, where one can unsubscribe or make any
>>> changes to their list subscription is:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> //www.freelists.org/list/mac4theblind
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The list archive is located at
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> //www.freelists.org/archive/mac4theblind/
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> All emails intended for the list owner can be sent to:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> john@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ************
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> You are subscribed to the mac4theblind mailing list.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The url for this list, where one can unsubscribe or make any
>>> changes to their list subscription is:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> //www.freelists.org/list/mac4theblind
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The list archive is located at
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> //www.freelists.org/archive/mac4theblind/
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> All emails intended for the list owner can be sent to:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> john@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> Jonnie Appleseed
>>>>>>> With His
>>>>>>> Hands-On Technolog(eye)s
>>>>>>> Touching The Internet
>>>>>>> Reducing Technology's disabilities
>>>>>>> One Byte At A Tie
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ************
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> You are subscribed to the mac4theblind mailing list.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The url for this list, where one can unsubscribe or make any
>>> changes to their list subscription is:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> //www.freelists.org/list/mac4theblind
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The list archive is located at
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> //www.freelists.org/archive/mac4theblind/
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> All emails intended for the list owner can be sent to:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> john@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ************
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> You are subscribed to the mac4theblind mailing list.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The url for this list, where one can unsubscribe or make any
>>> changes to their list subscription is:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> //www.freelists.org/list/mac4theblind
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The list archive is located at
>>>>>>
>>>>>> //www.freelists.org/archive/mac4theblind/
>>>>>>
>>>>>> All emails intended for the list owner can be sent to:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> john@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Jonnie Appleseed
>>>>>> with his
>>>>>> Hands-On Technolog(eye)s
>>>>>> reducing technology's disabilities
>>>>>> one byte at a time
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ************
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> You are subscribed to the mac4theblind mailing list.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The url for this list, where one can unsubscribe or make any
>>> changes to their list subscription is:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> //www.freelists.org/list/mac4theblind
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The list archive is located at
>>>>>>
>>>>>> //www.freelists.org/archive/mac4theblind/
>>>>>>
>>>>>> All emails intended for the list owner can be sent to:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> john@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ************
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> You are subscribed to the mac4theblind mailing list.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> The url for this list, where one can unsubscribe or make any
>>> changes to their list subscription is:
>>>>>
>>>>> //www.freelists.org/list/mac4theblind
>>>>>
>>>>> The list archive is located at
>>>>>
>>>>> //www.freelists.org/archive/mac4theblind/
>>>>>
>>>>> All emails intended for the list owner can be sent to:
>>>>>
>>>>> john@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ************
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> You are subscribed to the mac4theblind mailing list.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> The url for this list, where one can unsubscribe or make any
>>> changes to their list subscription is:
>>>>
>>>> //www.freelists.org/list/mac4theblind
>>>>
>>>> The list archive is located at
>>>>
>>>> //www.freelists.org/archive/mac4theblind/
>>>>
>>>> All emails intended for the list owner can be sent to:
>>>>
>>>> john@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Jonnie Appleseed
>>>> With His
>>>> Hands-On Technolog(eye)s
>>>> Touching The Internet
>>>> Reducing Technology's disabilities
>>>> One Byte At A Tie
>>>>
>>>> ************
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> You are subscribed to the mac4theblind mailing list.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> The url for this list, where one can unsubscribe or make any
>>> changes to their list subscription is:
>>>>
>>>> //www.freelists.org/list/mac4theblind
>>>>
>>>> The list archive is located at
>>>>
>>>> //www.freelists.org/archive/mac4theblind/
>>>>
>>>> All emails intended for the list owner can be sent to:
>>>>
>>>> john@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>
>>>
>>> ************
>>>
>>>
>>> You are subscribed to the mac4theblind mailing list.
>>>
>>>
>>> The url for this list, where one can unsubscribe or make any
>>> changes to their list subscription is:
>>>
>>> //www.freelists.org/list/mac4theblind
>>>
>>> The list archive is located at
>>>
>>> //www.freelists.org/archive/mac4theblind/
>>>
>>> All emails intended for the list owner can be sent to:
>>>
>>> john@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>
>> ************
>>
>>
>> You are subscribed to the mac4theblind mailing list.
>>
>>
>> The url for this list, where one can unsubscribe or make any changes to
>> their list subscription is:
>>
>> //www.freelists.org/list/mac4theblind
>>
>> The list archive is located at
>>
>> //www.freelists.org/archive/mac4theblind/
>>
>> All emails intended for the list owner can be sent to:
>>
>> john@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>
>
> ************
>
>
> You are subscribed to the mac4theblind mailing list.
>
>
> The url for this list, where one can unsubscribe or make any changes to
> their list subscription is:
>
> //www.freelists.org/list/mac4theblind
>
> The list archive is located at
>
> //www.freelists.org/archive/mac4theblind/
>
> All emails intended for the list owner can be sent to:
>
> john@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>
************
You are subscribed to the mac4theblind mailing list.
The url for this list, where one can unsubscribe or make any changes to
their list subscription is:
//www.freelists.org/list/mac4theblind
The list archive is located at
//www.freelists.org/archive/mac4theblind/
All emails intended for the list owner can be sent to:
john@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Other related posts:
