Wonderful and inspiring conversation. The priviledge and pain of working
for years with ritual abuse survivors here in Toronto, was my deepest
training in trauma therapy. I learnt how to make visible and encourage
conversations between many fragmented parts of self, to make peace within
the self even in the face of the most abhorrent acts.
Cults are essentially patriarchal, that is they are structured to maintain
male hierarchy and their own re-iterative structures of domination,
unquestioning loyalty, sexual accessibility for men and for some
male-identified women who rise to power. They are both sexually repressive
and sexually abusive, compulsorily heterosexual and based on ‘redemptive’
and sacrificial religious ideas to support lethal practices. They are often
racist and full of internalised racism re-enacted. Most of all, they are
familiar. That is, they echo the rigid transgenerational wounded dynamics
often passed along within families for many generations in response to
larger cultural woundings like colonization, genocide, slavery and
spiritual dislocation from the sacredness of life, the Earth and the
holders of life, that is women and children
.
For constellations work, it is extremely important that any patriarchal
ideas within training models, are not applied here. This whole conversation
can inspire us to see what lingers of such wounds (in the sort of themes
Leslie has sketched out) in our own constellations practices. It can also
help us ensure that cultish dynamics within constellations trainings and/or
organizations are revealed, named and healed.
Warmly, Eimear
On Mon, Sep 29, 2014 at 8:26 PM, Patricia Robertson pkrobertson22@xxxxxxxxx
[ConstellationTalk] <ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Hi all,
Chris made a good point about local traditional customs. I checked today
with an indigenous friend about the current birthing customs for his
community and he said,
"Traditionally, mid-wives, mothers, and female extended family members
assisted in childbirth. Today, attitudes and mindsets have changed. Today,
the father can assist in the birth of his children if he chooses to. He
would not be present in the delivery room for his grandchildren. Nothing
was concrete. If a man had to assist in childbirth during a traditional
era, then he would.” Context is important. His community is about 40
minutes from a hospital.
I found three good articles related to Sue’s comments about people living
in remote areas, birthing great distances away, fathers not being present,
and the impact on family systems:
Birthing at Home: It Takes a Village:
http://www.ottawacitizen.com/health/Birthing+home+takes+village/3888724/story.html
Inuit Midwife delivers in the outback:
http://www.ottawacitizen.com/health/Inuit+midwife+delivers+outback/3889440/story.html
The Residential Schools of Medicine:
http://www.ottawacitizen.com/health/residential+schools+medicine/3889424/story.html
*Patricia Robertson*
*Calgary Alberta Canada*
*patricia@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <patricia@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>*
*403-474-0452 <403-474-0452>*
*www.peacefulpossibilities.ca <http://www.peacefulpossibilities.ca>*
On Sep 29, 2014, at 12:42 AM, Chris Walsh chris@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[ConstellationTalk] <ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Hi all,
This is an interesting thought. However I know that in some indigenous
communities that men are kept right away from childbirth as it is
considered to be women's business.So I guess that may also need to be taken
into account.
Cheers
Chris Walsh
Melbourne, Australia
ph +61 (0)3 9487 4647
www.cwalsh.com.au
On Mon, Sep 29, 2014 at 11:30 AM, sue.mca-walkabout
Sue.McA-walkabout@xxxxxxxxxxx [ConstellationTalk]<
ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Re gang/disconnect/not sure about cults.
Talking with someone who works in Mental Health Services (Australia) with
indigenous clients who suggested the possibility of following initiatives
acted on in Eskimo communities of birthing in own community so fathers and
families connect and bond with the babies rather than the removal away from
communities into hospitals which are often some distance away. Is it
possible that this disconnect may contribute to gang development seen in
some remote areas? Advances in medicine and consequent hospitalisation for
childbirth coupled with the tyranny of distance may well be points of
disconnect within families. It would be interesting to see paternal
involvement pattern at birth in cult/gang members vs those not engaged in
cults/gangs as well as patterns in people working in remote situations like
stations/ mine work where fathers may be unable to attend births.
Good wishes
Sue
Sent from Samsung Mobile
-------- Original message --------
From: "Rosabelle White-Rice xochikezalli@xxxxxxx [ConstellationTalk]"
Date:27/09/2014 7:23 PM (GMT+08:00)
To: ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [ConstellationTalk] cults
Like in gangs, sounds like.
Rosabelle Bertha White Aguirre de Rice
Consteladora bilingüe -- diplomada en Hellinger Sciencia 2010 (CUDEC)
Bilingual Family Constellator -- Diplomate in Hellinger Sciencia 2010
Certified Spanish/English Interpreter
Intérprete Inglés/Español
Lafayette CO and Puebla Mexico
Facebook.com/xochikezalli <http://facebook.com/xochikezalli>
Skype: systemic.solutions
Cel. 720-838-9509
Ayudando a realizar sueños un ancestros a la vez
Helping your dreams come true one ancestor at a time
On 26 Sep 2014, at 09:47, Florencia Rodriguez flor.rodriguez.c@xxxxxxxxx
[ConstellationTalk]
<ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Hi Leslie,
In some groups leaded by a guru I found that members in big number have
physically or emotionally absent fathers. The cult leader fills the void of
the father, giving security to the participants.
Flroencia
2014-09-23 17:51 GMT-06:00 Leslie Nipps lnipps@xxxxxxxxx
[ConstellationTalk] <ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>:
Dear Friends,
Do any of you have any experience working with clients who grew up in
cults? I’m curious about your observations about the systemic patterns for
these situations. I shall be doing a constellation with a thirty year old
client who was her parents’ only child, and who grew up in a cult. They
remain in it, and she left some time ago. There are obvious impacts of this
sort of thing, but was wondering whether any of you had noticed any
patterns about where the attraction to joining a cult might come from, so I
can be on the lookout in the family system. Some of the sourcing on the
mother’s side looks pretty suggestive (a family history of molestation) but
there’s no useful info on the father’s side. So, just interested in any
patterns you may have noticed. Thanks so much!
I so appreciate the wide experience of this group.
The Rev. Leslie Nipps, NLP & Family Constellations Practitioner
“Trust as a Way of Life…”
www.leslienipps.com
leslie@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
