[mac4theblind] Re: Strange and startling dream
- From: John Panarese <john@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: mac4theblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2015 15:11:21 -0400
The bottom line is competition. Competition breed innovation and
advancement. Without it, you have stagnation. We've seen it happen in other
markets. I pray it doesn't happen with our accessibility to computers as blind
people.
Take Care
John D. Panarese
Director
Mac for the Blind
Tel, (631) 724-4479
Email, john@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Website, http://www.macfortheblind.com
APPLE CERTIFIED SUPPORT PROFESSIONAL FOR MAC OSX 10.7 LION and 10.8 Mountain
Lion
AUTHORIZED APPLE STORE BUSINESS AFFILIATE
MAC and iOS VOICEOVER TRAINING AND SUPPORT
> On Mar 23, 2015, at 3:05 PM, Scott Granados <scott@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
> And I don’t think just because voiceover is built in that precludes other
> people from entering the space. I myself wouldn’t want to compete with Apple
> but that doesn’t mean someone else wouldn’t feel differently.
>
> On Mar 23, 2015, at 2:39 PM, John Panarese <john@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
>> No, I think having one company responsible for the OS and the screen reader
>> is a much better long term solution. NVDA is open source and open to a
>> community of developers. As I said, it has drawbacks compared to
>> Window-Eyes and JAWS, and those limitations cannot be compared necessarily
>> across platforms. In reality, all screen readers conceptual set out to do
>> the same things, but on the Mac because of the Mac's stability and security,
>> that alone gives it plenty of advantage over Windows.
>>
>> As for complex keyboard combination, know your screen reader. The same
>> things can be said for Windows too. With VO, use Numpad Commander, Keyboard
>> commander or a third party product like, Spark, and your complexity is
>> simplified tremendously.
>>
>> The bottom line is I get work done on my Mac with VoiceOver and I don't
>> fight with the OS. In Windows, half the time is spent dealing with the OS
>> and Trying to get work done.
>>
>>
>> Take Care
>>
>> John D. Panarese
>> Director
>> Mac for the Blind
>> Tel, (631) 724-4479
>> Email, john@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> Website, http://www.macfortheblind.com
>>
>> APPLE CERTIFIED SUPPORT PROFESSIONAL FOR MAC OSX 10.7 LION and 10.8 Mountain
>> Lion
>>
>> AUTHORIZED APPLE STORE BUSINESS AFFILIATE
>>
>> MAC and iOS VOICEOVER TRAINING AND SUPPORT
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>> On Mar 23, 2015, at 2:28 PM, Todor Fassl <fassl.tod@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>
>>> Oh, I forgot to mention ... I'm not sure that being integrated into the
>>> operating system is a significant advantage. The main advantage appears to
>>> be that it works right out of the box. There's no installation.
>>>
>>> But are you prepared to say that voiceover works better than nvda? If so,
>>> how? I mean, what does voiceover do better than nvda?
>>>
>>> Being integrated into the operating system has it's drawbacks. For one,
>>> voiceover has no competition. For better or worse, we're stuck with
>>> voiceober and Apple's idea of accessibility. It does take some very
>>> complicated key combinations to use voiceover. That's probably the result
>>> of Apple not wanting voiceover to interfere with other operating system
>>> functions. Some people have been critical of Apple's response time when it
>>> comes to fixing bugs in voiceover. I've een bugs fixed the same day they
>>> were reported in orca and nvda.
>>>
>>> To be clear, having voiceover come with an Apple product is a great thing.
>>> If you're going to buy Apple products anyway, you don't have to buy a
>>> screen reader. This is a terrific thing. But I'm not sure that being
>>> integrated into the OS automatically makes voiceover better than other
>>> screen readers. There is a difference between quality and value.
>>>
>>> On 03/23/2015 09:42 AM, Scott Granados wrote:
>>>> And all are bolt on after thoughts. NVDA, JFW, WE, what ever they are all
>>>> after thoughts compared to Voice Over which is integrated like any other
>>>> feature in the OS.
>>>>
>>>> On Mar 23, 2015, at 10:26 AM, Todor Fassl <fassl.tod@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> There is a free screen reader for Windows though. It's called nvda.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On 03/23/2015 08:57 AM, Scott Granados wrote:
>>>>>> Actually, the Mac is not more expensive when you add in the cost of the
>>>>>> screen reader. Remember you need to add a grand or so if you’re
>>>>>> installing JFW on that new machine so add that to the cost. Voice Over
>>>>>> is included for free so that cost is already covered.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Mar 23, 2015, at 9:20 AM, Lena Contreras <contreras_lena@xxxxxx>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Yes. My Mac is approaching five years old. When I had my other windows
>>>>>>> laptops, when they were around four years old they would start acting
>>>>>>> strangely. They would crash for no reason the speech would stop working
>>>>>>> and I would have to reboot or other strange things would happen. So
>>>>>>> far, my Mac is running fine. I know Friends that have eight or
>>>>>>> nine-year-old Max that are running well but won't support the latest
>>>>>>> OSX. When somebody's getting a new computer, I recommend a Macintosh.
>>>>>>> But some of my friends are Fred to make the switch because of having to
>>>>>>> relearn things. Also the Mac is more expensive and they want to spend
>>>>>>> less on the computer. And some of my computer geek friends don't like
>>>>>>> the "control "that Apple has.
>>>>>>> Lena
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Sent from my iPad
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Mar 23, 2015, at 5:31 AM, Scott Granados <scott@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> +1 Microsoft has scarred me too. It’s hard to get over that level of
>>>>>>>> bad design and lack of security.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On Mar 22, 2015, at 11:47 AM, John Panarese <john@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Unfortunately, I keep having this nightmare that I still have to use
>>>>>>>>> Windows to train a few clients, but it's actually reality and not
>>>>>>>>> some bad dream. I guess, in your case, the psychological scars remain
>>>>>>>>> ...
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Take Care
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> John D. Panarese
>>>>>>>>> Director
>>>>>>>>> Mac for the Blind
>>>>>>>>> Tel, (631) 724-4479
>>>>>>>>> Email, john@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>>>>> Website, http://www.macfortheblind.com
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> APPLE CERTIFIED SUPPORT PROFESSIONAL FOR MAC OSX 10.7 LION and 10.8
>>>>>>>>> Mountain Lion
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> AUTHORIZED APPLE STORE BUSINESS AFFILIATE
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> MAC and iOS VOICEOVER TRAINING AND SUPPORT
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> On Mar 22, 2015, at 10:30 AM, Lena Contreras <contreras_lena@xxxxxx>
>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I was listening to a couple podcasts yesterday about the new Apple
>>>>>>>>>> MacBook and Apple Watch. Last night I had a strange dream. I dreamt
>>>>>>>>>> that I was typing away on a laptop who's screen would not stay open
>>>>>>>>>> and I had to lay it down flat on the table like an iPad. It didn't
>>>>>>>>>> bother me though because I was listening to the voice and did not
>>>>>>>>>> need to see the screen and an angle.
>>>>>>>>>> I remember I was typing and all of a sudden realize that there was
>>>>>>>>>> no voice feedback. When I checked to see if the computer was running
>>>>>>>>>> it had crashed. I somehow knew that it was a Windows machine and
>>>>>>>>>> wondered why I did not hear the sound I had originally used to tell
>>>>>>>>>> me when the computer was crashing. I remember feeling frustrated and
>>>>>>>>>> thinking that I should get a Mac. I just thought it was very weird
>>>>>>>>>> to have this dream when my MacBook Pro is running well and I have
>>>>>>>>>> not touched a Windows computer in about five years. Funny how the
>>>>>>>>>> brain works.
>>>>>>>>>> Lena
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone************
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
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